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Author Topic: Gay rights anger goes nationwide  (Read 399 times)
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piccolo_rocks
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« on: November 17, 2008, 02:05:32 PM »

From today's Age (http://www.theage.com.au/world/gay-rights-anger-goes-nationwide-20081116-683l.html?page=-1)
There's also a cool picture that goes with it:

Gay rights anger goes nationwide

Badges featuring pictures of US President-elect Barack Obama during a demonstration to condemn the ban of same-sex marriages.

Badges featuring pictures of US President-elect Barack Obama during a demonstration to condemn the ban of same-sex marriages.

BEARING signs such as "No More Mr Nice Gay" and "We're Not Asking for Five Wives — Just One", more than 10,000 New Yorkers yesterday joined in a nationwide backlash against California's voting down of same-sex marriage rights.

It was the second major protest within days in New York, the previous one targeting the Mormon Church — hence the reference to multiple wives — for its role in financing the anti-gay marriage campaign.

California's overturning of state gay marriage rights may have sparked a national movement, with protests held yesterday in Boston, Philadelphia, Chicago and San Francisco. The reaction follows the success of Proposition 8, which overturned a Supreme Court decision legalising gay marriage in California.

Groups competing for and against Proposition 8 spent a combined $A110 million in the campaign leading up to the November 4 poll. It was the second most expensive campaign after the presidential contest between Barack Obama and John McCain.

Legal experts suggest the thousands of gay marriages enacted since the court ruling will be allowed to stand. Only two states, Connecticut and Massachusetts, continue to permit same-sex marriage.

"I was so euphoric over the election of Obama, and then hearing this the next morning, it was such a let-down," said Mark Black, 59. Mr Black, who is in a registered domestic partnership, said that his employer health benefits would be denied to his partner of 14 years when Mr Black retired, whereas if they were legally married the benefits would continue.

Democratic congressman Anthony Weiner, who is seen as a possible challenger to Mayor Michael Bloomberg, told the rally he would push for same-sex marriage to be introduced to New York. "America is not the country we should be until we overturn things like Proposition 8," said Mr Weiner, who was introduced as a "straight ally of marriage equality".

"We are not going to rest until every citizen in every state in our country has the right to stand up and say this is the man or woman I love and we want to express that love in the form of marriage," he said.

Among those at the New York rally were David Allen, who married his partner Michael McGrann under Massachusetts law in 2004. The couple has since adopted a son, Theo.

"One of the things that was really offensive to me about the whole gay marriage campaign was how they tried to be pro-family, yet they wanted to disallow my family," said Mr Allen. "It's hard to know how this is going to continue. I think it's great there's been such a response to it."

He said if court challenges to Proposition 8 failed to defeat it, then it would be challenged at the ballot box in two years' time.

Following last week's demonstration, the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints issued a weekend plea for restraint.

The church said that both sides of the Proposition 8 argument had ample opportunity to express their views and more than 40 states in the US had now voted against gay marriage.

"Attacks on churches and intimidation of people of faith have no place in civil discourse over controversial issues. People of faith have a democratic right to express their views in the public square without fear of reprisal," the church said.

The church has renounced polygamy, although it is still practised by sects claiming to adhere to "fundamentalist Mormon" principles.

Kim Stoltz, a competitor on reality television's America's Next Top Model, said that the "arc of history" was on the side of supporters of gay marriage.

If no voters over the age of 65 had taken part, Proposition 8 would have have failed, she said.

"I am an American citizen, I am gay and I believe I will be equal," Ms Stoltz said.
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« Reply #1 on: November 17, 2008, 08:29:02 PM »

"Attacks on churches and intimidation of people of faith have no place in civil discourse over controversial issues. People of faith have a democratic right to express their views in the public square without fear of reprisal," the church said.
Yeah, and people should also have a democratic right to express their sexuality in the public square without fear and discrimination.
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CaptainPotato
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« Reply #2 on: November 18, 2008, 11:41:24 AM »

Quote
"Attacks on churches and intimidation of people of faith have no place in civil discourse over controversial issues. People of faith have a democratic right to express their views in the public square without fear of reprisal," the church said.

Well... yes and no.  If "reprisal" means violence or the threat of violence, then yes, that's horrific, and all people should be able to express their religious and political views without being intimidated.  If, however, "reprisal" means other people and groups exercising their right to criticise your views and actions, then that's perfectly legitimate.

I've got to admit, there's a lot of things I don't like about the anti-Prop 8 protest movement.  The Mormon-baiting is just one of those things.  All the Mormons I know are nice people who have never given any indication that they see me as having fewer rights than anyone else.  They're not, you know, stormtroopers.  Queer activists need to make the distinction between the hierarchy of the LDS Church and the average believer.  Kind of like we can criticise the Vatican without hating on the 2 billion-or-so Catholics in the world.
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Kathleen_The_Terrible
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« Reply #3 on: November 18, 2008, 12:49:53 PM »

All the Mormons I know are nice people who have never given any indication that they see me as having fewer rights than anyone else.  They're not, you know, stormtroopers.  Queer activists need to make the distinction between the hierarchy of the LDS Church and the average believer.  Kind of like we can criticise the Vatican without hating on the 2 billion-or-so Catholics in the world.

I think there's a few number of activists who have said they're criticising the elders who donated the money and publicly backed Prop 8, but unfortunately there are many taking this out on the wrong people. I agree with you btw, nobody should EVER attack a member of a church or organisation just because the people in charge made a fuckup.
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ProfessionalWidow
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« Reply #4 on: November 20, 2008, 01:02:35 AM »

Though umm... by being a member of the Church they are also responsible if they don't work/are outspoken against such things.  They may not be outwardly supporting it but they're giving their silent consent for the leadership to act in this way.
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Sean
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« Reply #5 on: December 31, 2008, 08:41:59 PM »

Quote
They may not be outwardly supporting it but they're giving their silent consent for the leadership to act in this way.
There is no such thing as "silent consent".
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ProfessionalWidow
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« Reply #6 on: January 01, 2009, 08:15:06 PM »

There is no such thing as "Sean".
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Sean
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« Reply #7 on: January 02, 2009, 12:18:00 PM »

There is no such thing as "ProfessionalWidow".
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ProfessionalWidow
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« Reply #8 on: January 02, 2009, 03:08:58 PM »

lol.

It takes much more than someone coming onto a forum looking for arguments and fights by making antagonistic statements to get me riled up.  I'd discuss your comment but you're not interested in an exhange of dialogue.  So, why attempt it?

Anyone else want to discuss this topic?
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Sean
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« Reply #9 on: January 02, 2009, 04:43:57 PM »

Quote
I'd discuss your comment but you're not interested in an exhange of dialogue.
Who said that I'm not interested in an exchange of dialogue? We've already exchanged dialogue as it is.
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ProfessionalWidow
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« Reply #10 on: January 02, 2009, 05:46:59 PM »

To answer your question by looking above, I think it was ME that says you're not interested in an exchange of dialogue. But I'm not quite sure, maybe you'll want to double check.

And I beg to differ about exchanging dialogue so far (not including this post). We have just posted statements, not conversed.
« Last Edit: January 02, 2009, 05:48:40 PM by ProfessionalWidow » Logged
Sean
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« Reply #11 on: January 03, 2009, 08:21:39 PM »

So, you're not interested in exchanging dialogue?
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ProfessionalWidow
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« Reply #12 on: January 04, 2009, 12:39:51 AM »

No more than you are. 

There's no need to be so combative all the time Sean.  It puts people off.  Especially when you're not interested in trying to see things from others point of view.  Me, I like to exchange dialogue and ideas and hear other people's opinions, even if they differ from my own.
« Last Edit: January 04, 2009, 12:43:26 AM by ProfessionalWidow » Logged
Kror
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« Reply #13 on: January 04, 2009, 12:45:46 AM »

As fun as it is to watch the clever repartee here, if you're not going to actually discuss the thread's topic or the topic that the thread evolved into... Please take it to PMs.
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ProfessionalWidow
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« Reply #14 on: January 04, 2009, 01:57:55 PM »

http://au.youtube.com/watch?v=x-DGMTtqEbk

Interesting clip of Kirk Cameron talking with O'Reilly about gays protesting Proposition 8.  It shows footage of some gays throwing some preaching Christians out of their neighbourhood.
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